Did I mention that Dolly Mixture were the second band I ever saw live? Well, somehow that was 45 summers ago now, barely an hour before the first of many live sightings of The Undertones, at Guildford Civic Hall in June 1981.
Around that time this colourfully turned out Cambridge trio, formed in 1978 by bassist/vocalist Debsey Wykes, guitarist/vocalist Rachel Bor and drummer Hester Smith, also supported The Jam, another huge influence on yours truly, the girls clearly as impressed as I was to see those bands at close quarters.
Dolly Mixture also played with Bad Manners and The Fall, can count U2 among their support acts, had records produced by the Bay City Rollers’ Eric Faulkner then The Damned’s Captain Sensible and Paul Gray, and were encouraged en route by influential broadcaster John Peel.
But to paraphrase Chris Tarrant on Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?, we don’t want to give you that. Not today anyway. Lots of those tales were lovingly relayed by Debsey in her Dolly Mixture memoir, Teenage Daydream: We are the Girls Who Play in a Band, (New Modern, 2025). What I will say though is that I felt a certain pride when they hit the big time a year later as backing singers for the aforementioned Captain, joining a fella once known as Ray Burns (to me a more punk rock nom de plume than that he chose) in the studio and on Top of the Pops on Rodgers & Hammerstein cover ‘Happy Talk’, a UK No.1, follow-up ‘Wot!’ and anti-war classic ‘Glad It’s All Over’ (they didn’t record that, but performed it on the box).
In time, Rachel and the Captain became an item, family following. And later a working partnership led to far more with Steve Lovell, the Liverpudlian producer (whose impressive output included many records in my collection, Blur, Carter USM, Departure Lounge, Elastica, Holly Johnson, James, Julian Cope, The Railway Children, and Sultans of Ping FC among them). Meanwhile, she continued to make music, for some time now going out under the name Rachel Love.
I was an Adrian Mole-like 13 and three-quarters when I caught Dolly Mixture live, and a year older when ‘Happy Talk’ topped the charts, reminiscing about that with Debsey as she signed my copy of her book at Manchester’s Louder Than Words festival last November. And recently I had the pleasure of a long chat with her ex-bandmate, Rachel now back on the road and on the tracks with Railcard, rightfully receiving acclaim for their debut LP.
It wasn’t until 2025 that she met Railcard partners Ian Button (Death in Vegas, Thrashing Doves, The Catenary Wires, The Penrose Web, Swansea Sound) and Peter Momtchiloff (Heavenly, Talulah Gosh, Would-Be-Goods) at a gig, realising they were the same age, seeing that as reason enough to form a band. As they put it, ‘The shared history, the same pop references, the parallel lives… Railcard had to happen and there was no time to lose.’
Hence Two Steps At A Time – the LP title and theme song – expressing how quickly they’ve worked since, the quartet completed by Allison Thomson (Trash Can Sinatras, Love, The Orchids, Departure Lounge), the album out now via Skep Wax and Slumberland, an exclusive edition of 300 copies including a seven-inch single with additional tracks, available at select UK record shops and at the merch stand when you catch them live.
When I got hold of Rachel, she was at home in her ‘music room / bedroom’ in Hassocks, a town I still associate with The Wedding Present (their early years’ ‘Manchester, Bramley, Gateshead, Hassocks’ logo paying homage to Shaun Charman’s homebase, the Weddoes’ drummer now back on the south coast and playing with Jetstream Pony). I mention this to Rachel, and she mentions another rock ‘n’ roll link.
‘Actually, it has quite a history. There was the Downs Hotel, where The Who and the Stones played. Funny, because it’s not that kind of place at all… although there is a place by the station that is an Americana kind of venue.’
Ever take your guitar down and give the locals a taste of bluegrass or some such?
‘No, I haven’t done that!’
In fact, Hassocks has been home for Rachel for almost 30 years, apparently, her children growing up here. So there’s a further reason to celebrate this Sussex town.
‘Jumping over pavement cracks, giving people heart attacks,
They don’t expect me to move like that, but it’s the only way for me.’
The day we spoke I’d had the first of many listens to the new LP, finding it joyous from the start, opening with something of a band manifesto with the title track, Railcard’s ‘theme tune’ (it ‘could have been an alternative theme tune for Whatever Happened To The Likely Lads, says their label). Question is, have they set a record for earliest whistling on an album, contending with Peter, Bjorn and John, Roger Whittaker, and Whistling Jack Smith?
‘Ha! I don’t know. Ian sends me lyrics and I write the tunes, and putting it down I suddenly broke into a whistle. And I don’t know why!’
So you’re the chief whistler?
‘Yes, but funnily enough, none of us are very good at it, so live it’s been a bit of a challenge!’ I can whistle, but it just isn’t that strong. But Ian can do a really good kind of ‘suck in’ whistle. And he makes the most noise. Ha!’
I had to listen back to that part of the conversation a couple of times to ensure I had it right. And kudos for them replicating that live. I think of classic whistles like Otis Redding on ‘(Sittin’ On) ‘The Dock of the Bay’, which would have been a tall order if he’d had the chance to play that live.
‘Funnily enough, we were doing a quiz at the end of Glas-Goes Pop, and one question was, ‘’What do these songs have in common?’ They played ‘Dock of the Bay’, and I sat there whistling, then the second one was us. So it was, ‘Oh, that’s the answer! Well, there you go.’ So I got one right!’
Moving on to track two, ‘1962’s the Future’, I gather that was the year you and bandmates Ian and Peter were born, right?
‘Exactly. And Paul Kelly, as it was the four of us sitting round in a slightly inebriated state, realising we were all born very close to each other, time-wise, so ‘let’s form a band!’ That was a bit of a joke that night… but me and Ian took it seriously!’
Paul Kelly, by the way, is Rachel’s ex-bandmate Debsey’s partner, the pair previously with Birdie and Saint Etienne, his CV also including films made with and about Dexys, Dolly Mixture, and cult indie star Lawrence.
So is there a deeper message within, about 1962 being your year of innocence? Or have you not thought about it that way?
‘Well, the first song Ian gave me was ‘Flannelette’. After that, I said, ‘We should have a theme song, shouldn’t we?’ And soon after, he sent me those lyrics.’
I have to say I’ve got a tad confused of late, receiving regular emails from both yourselves via Skep Wax Records, and Great Western Railways, both with the Railcard catchline. And that’s not helped by this LP title, seeing as most of my GWR mail concerns the Two Together railcard I share with my better half.
‘The brilliant thing is they got in touch with us. We were a bit worried that we were using that name, Railcard, waiting for them to say, ‘Sorry, you can’t use it.’
That had crossed my mind. A cease and desist letter?
‘Actually, they wrote to us to say. ‘We love what you’re doing, and want to offer you Two Together railcards!’ And they have – me and Ian on one, Pete and Alison on the other. And we’re doing a few gigs by train, so that’s brilliant.’
In the words of their press release, ‘You have to wonder why Railcard took so long to be born. Their debut album feels like it should have been in your collection for years.’ I get that. With new music I love these days, there’s often a feeling that I already know a song. Maybe it’s just recognition of the influences or general vibe.
‘Yeah, and some kind of magic happened when we got together. I’d only spoken to Ian once before that night, but then that magic happened.’
Ian has a lower band profile with label mates Swansea Sound, however important to the band dynamic. But that’s not how it works with Railcard.
‘He’s in so many bands, including The Penrose Web, who are brilliant. He’s a bit of a genius. I feel very lucky we’ve connected. But you’re right – he doesn’t push himself forward.’
Were you aware of him in Death in Vegas and Thrashing Doves days?
‘I had no idea. I’m discovering things about him all the time!’
Taking the rail analogy further, it’s as if you’ve all suddenly appeared on the same stretch of track, with Allison the latest on board, providing voice, trumpet, keyboard, and what have you. And she seems to have nailed the band’s sound through her contributions.
‘She adds a huge amount, not only trumpet, keyboards and her singing, she’s writing as well, But it’s also about personality and the look. She’s just perfect.’
Even though she wasn’t born in ’62 (1970, I gather).
‘No, but we let her in! ‘She’s a youngster!’
I see her past appearances included those with Love. And it’s only just struck me that we’re talking about Arthur Lee’s legendary band rather than the Rachel Love Band.
‘Ah, I get what you mean! Pete knew her because she played on the Would-Be-Goods album. Ian had met her, so it was like, ‘Oh, trumpet would be great on a few of these songs!’ And as soon as I met her, it was a case of, ‘Oh, yeah!’
Her trumpet accentuates certain songs, in a Bacharach and David style. I also like the occasional Sixties keyboard touches. On that front, one part reminds me of a band you had a close link to in Dolly Mixture days, The Undertones’ ‘The Love Parade’ brought to mind, with its nod to the Nuggets sound.
‘Ah, which song?’
I’ll get back to you on that… when I reach that bit on my notes.
‘Well, generally the keyboard was down to me and Ian, but also Alison.’
Track three, ‘Hillman Minx’ is another breath of fresh air, and there’s that Sixties theme again. In fact, I feel you’ve created something of a soundtrack album, maybe for a road movie about discovery in its many forms… involving a little time travel too.
‘Peter wrote that. And I suppose we were thinking about when we grew up.’
You seem to be a very good fit for the Skep Wax label, not just because of the links between Peter with Heavenly and Ian with others on the label. It’s as if you’d already signed with them… before you formed that inebriated evening.
‘Ha! It’s only been a year and a half, but yeah.’
‘When life gets too itchy for you only one material will do – flannelette’
Latest single, ‘Flannelette’ is a case in point regarding that filmic feel, somewhere between Sixties French B-movie and Eighties indie charm. It’s kind of wistful, in the same way the rather sweet ‘Foxy’ (‘mysterious and charming,’ with ‘more than a hint of Kate Bush December magic’) is rather more pensive. And they’re all rather cinematic.
‘Ah, that’s good. I suppose the music just came from the feel of the lyrics.’
You’re clearly on a plane… albeit a DC-4 airliner operated by BEA. Has Ian sat on a few of these lyrics for a while – pre-Railcard?
‘Some of them, ‘I’m a Disaster’ was one he already had. And from the last album, he already had ‘Northern Soul Dancing’. There are some I had as well. I was writing with Martin Newell for a project, The Light Music Company, a few ideas for that coming to Railcard instead.’
Talking of side one closer, ‘I’m a Disaster’ (‘The Kinks meets deadpan Shangri-Las,’ says Skep Wax), either my earphones are knackered or there’s some fuzzy guitar there to complement Ian’s more raspy tones.
‘Well, we were putting the backing track down in the studio and I very confidently played a really nasty chord, and Ian’s placed it in the middle, several times! A disastrous chord.’
When my better half advises me when we’re driving somewhere that I’ve taken a questionable turn, I tell her there is no wrong way – we’ll eventually get there; in the meantime relax and experience something fresh and unexpected. Is that you in the studio?
‘Ha! Definitely. I mean, some of the songs I’ve been really proud of I’ve done something and there’s been an accident of some sort where I tried to transpose things, it’s gone off, and I think, ‘Ooh, that’s not what I meant, but that’s quite good!’
Gotta love a tangent. And for me, ‘I’m a Disaster’ suggests The Rezillos grown up… unlikely as that seems.
‘Well, it was fun, and Ian changed the lyrics so it was like a duet.’
It works, bringing to mind The Primitives’ ‘Carry Me Home’ on Lovely. I like a change of pace and a little juxtaposition here and there.
‘Yes, something a bit different.’
At the same time, you and Ian are Nancy and Lee, of course.
‘Ha!’
Side two opener ‘Paper Thin’ is some way removed from that, far more laidback and reflective.
‘That’s another Pete wrote. A lovely song.’
True. He suggests, ‘The world is paper thin, the universe is cursed, if you just prick a pin we’ll burst.’ Is that an all-encompassing take on our planet in 2026?
‘I imagine that’s what he was thinking. The vulnerability of it all.’
‘Unstable neighbour smoking a fag, he’d pick an argument with a plastic bag.’
Next song, ‘Unstable Neighbour’ is glorious from start to finish, like a more radio-friendly take on Can. Kraftwerk, even. And it’s the song that first jumped out at me.
‘Ha! It was so funny. I went to see Ian play with a band in Brighton, and before he went on stage, I said, “I won’t be here at the end. I’ve got to get home for the dog because I’ve got an unstable neighbour,’ Which I did have for 27 years… until he moved in January.
‘Next day, Ian sent me those lyrics. I hadn’t even told him the horrible details. We’ve actually got a couple of songs about him, with another on my last record. It’s all very cathartic!’
The label suggests hints of Stereolab. Even an indiepop Hawkwind. It’s certainly very European in its scope.
‘Well, I absolutely love Stereolab.’
Did the original song sound anything like it would end up on the record?
‘Yeah, it’s not so different from how we first did it. Ian added vocoder… which was fun. We tend to send things backwards and forwards, and they kind of develop.’
By the way, that Undertones-like keyboard I mentioned is on ‘Runaround’ (’like a school choir doing The Raincoats’), reminiscent of their more psychedelic Sixties-soaked Positive Touch era, coincidentally when I saw you support them.‘
‘Ah! What, the de-de-de-de-de-de-de’ bit?
Erm, maybe.
‘That was a very out of tune piano at {Skep Wax duo} Rob and Amelia’s place.’
Oh, yes, that’s also in there… along with some lovely harmonies from you and Alison. In fact, with your vocal range, the harmonies with all your bandmates, and the occasional guitar flourishes, I’m reminded here and elsewhere of Girls at Our Best and 1981 cult classic Pleasure. Were they ever on your radar?
‘Not at all. I didn’t know anything about them. That’s interesting. We didn’t meet that many bands back then… just at gigs. Even then we didn’t get on with some of them!’
Having read Debsey’s splendid memoir, I’m guessing The Mo-Dettes are alluded to there.
‘Ooh… could have been! Even then, for some reason, it was only Jane {Crockford} who really hated us. The others were fine. I met her years later and she was wearing a spotty dress. I said, ‘Oh, looks like you’re wearing a Dolly Mixture dress!’ Ha! But she was fine.
‘There was one music journalist too. Debsey wrote about her too… ‘Candy Twist’. She obviously had it in for us, and was the one that got all the girl bands together – there was a huge bit about how awful they all thought we were… which was crazy – it shouldn’t have been about whether you were a girl or not. We had nothing in common – we played very different music. She was making it into a girl against girls thing, which was ridiculous.’
And back on the subject of ‘Runaround’, I get the impression the live version could be a bit more souped up.
‘I do think it’s going to be too hard to play. We had a go, and it’s very hard. We’ll have to work on that!’
Maybe you can play it at your 20th anniversary shows in 2046 or thereabouts, explaining to the audience, ‘We’ve never actually played this live before.’
As for ‘When You Say You Love Me, Something’s Wrong’, including guitar from her son, David Lovell, that’s heart on sleeve fare, I’d venture. A love song with a twist, confusion reigning.
‘Yeah. Again, that’s Ian’s lyrics. He’s very clever.’
‘Long nights and dazzling days, and jet-set ways,
Snowblind, away from yesterday.’
‘Snow Blind’, the penultimate number, I’d expect – like ‘Foxy’ earlier – on a Magnetic North record. It’s full of twist and turns, deceptively simple, your dreamy tones underpinned by Ian’s gravel-throated take on Lee Hazelwood again, taking it somewhere else, building up through subtle swathes of sound and added layers. Glorious.
‘Yeah, it’s unusual. I wrote some music, thinking it was a bit James Bond-like, sent it to him… and that’s what he came up with. It is kind of mysterious.’
It certainly is, and in the tradition of the second-last album track, the one leading us towards the final song. And I guess that also suggests the album’s rather neatly sequenced.
‘Ah, thank you. It’s a bit of drama before the quiet end.’
As for that somewhat ethereal finale, the reflective ‘Sunday Sun’, it’s almost a full circle moment. And across the record there’s that rather timeless quality.
‘Yeah, it just seemed like a nice way to end.’
While the LP’s self-produced, Medway’s own Allan Crockford (of The Prisoners and James Taylor Quartet fame, also responsible for the band’s initial EPs) mixed it. How much of an impact did he make with the sound and feel of the record?
‘He’s in The Penrose Web with Ian, who said it’d be good to have him involved. He has all sorts of plugins and things, so he said it would be great if he had a go at mixing. And he adds a huge amount – a really big sound, and it’s great that he’s happy to be involved.’
As hinted at before, this isn’t the first Railcard product. There was also a 10-track collection comprising those initial digital EPs, gathered onto CD. And it sold out quickly.
‘Yeah, but we’ve had some more done now, and they’ll be available again.’
Clearly, the demand’s there. Did that give you more confidence and optimism that you were going in the right direction? Or is confidence not in short supply?
‘It’s lovely how people are so interested… but I don’t think it’s going to influence anything we do. We’ll just do it!’
You’ve all been around a while in music, yet you’re still at it, something that suggests you’re doing it for the right reasons.
‘Absolutely. We love doing it. And it’s just it’s just nice to have another go!’
There’s no lack of Eighties and Nineties indie charm with Railcard, but your Sixties sensibilities clearly remain intact too, And that was the case when you started out with your first band all those years ago.
‘Yes, with Dolly Mixture we loved the harmonies of the girl groups from the Sixties as well as the poppy kind of punk, like the Buzzcocks and The Undertones, and we loved Blondie and all those good songs that came out of punk.’
As well as The Undertones, I’m guessing you have good memories of your time supporting The Jam back in those days too.
‘Oh yeah, it was all very exciting!’
Working on my Jam book I was reminded of your part in a 1981 edition of TV magazine show Something Else that Paul Weller helped put together, also featuring music from The Jam and The Questions. Watching it back, I felt it was a great snapshot in time, and it was good to see Dolly Mixture playing ‘Beenteen’.
‘Yeah, although we played our song through and it was all perfect, then they said, ‘Can we do it one more time, please?’ Then I went wrong, and that’s the one up there now, online!’
That’s a conversation for another day, as are her days recording with Captain Sensible. Rachel did, however, add that they remain on good terms.
‘We’ve three kids together, all grown up, and he comes and stays with my daughter, so we see each other then. Fred, our eldest, is 41.’
Blimey, time certainly flies, not least when you consider that Rachel was just 15 when she joined Dolly Mixture. The girls certainly packed a lot into their half a dozen years together… and Rachel has continued to do so.
‘I know, and it was a very different world then. With my kids, I kind of lost track of what was going on musically for a long time.’
We all have that time out, for various reasons. There are certain bands and records I’ve only discovered fairly recently, thinking ‘how did I not know them?’ But maybe it’s just about new priorities and responsibilities, not least while bringing up a young family with very little time and money for other stuff.
‘Yeah, you’re thrown into a completely different world.’
Can you bear to look back at those appearances on Top of the Pops and other TV shows?
‘Oh yeah, religiously! It’s a very different me though.’
And yet you always remained in music to some extent.
‘Yeah. I’d go on to meet Steve, who I had one boy with. He produced Julian Cope’s first two solo albums and had a lot to do with bands in Liverpool. He signed one of my bands to his production company in the Nineties. That didn’t work out, but we got together.’
Sadly, Steve, who also featured in an early incarnation of Frankie Goes to Hollywood, passed away in early 2021.
‘Unfortunately, he died five years ago. He produced my first solo album, and our son produced the second one. And we played a lot together… very low key.’
That CV includes releases with the aforementioned Light Music Company, also involving her son David, and those two Rachel Love LPs (2021’s Picture in Mind and 2024’s Lyra, the latter including bass and guitar from her son Syd).
Has she still got family and friends around Cambridge, where it started with Dolly Mixture?
‘I grew up there, and my parents always lived there, but I moved away when we had our first child, and I wasn’t really so much part of that scene, although Robyn Hitchcock was really supportive. I’m still in touch with him.’
Robyn certainly played his part in that story too, his credits appearing on the first two Captain Sensible LPs, including a co-write on unlikely but charming anthem, ‘Croydon’. But again, another time…
As for Dolly Mixture, I’ll always have that connection, and feel they deserved success in their own right. More than anything though, I’m pleased to see and hear Rachel remains on form all these years on, still enjoying it, still creative. And does she retain a passion for the live aspect?
‘Oh, absolutely, I love it.’
And do you get nervous going out, or was that never an issue?
‘I don’t know if I’m that nervous. I love it. I don’t know how good I am, but I really enjoy it.’
Following live shows in Rolvenden Layne, Skep Wax Records’ Kentish base, plus Sutton, Rainham, Brighton, Ramsgate, Islington, Bristol and Coventry, Railcard are supporting the Would-Be-Goods at a matinee show at Sheffield’s Sidney and Matilda venue (October 10), then play the New Inn, Sandwich (October 31) followed by further autumn shows with the Would-Be-Goods at Edinburgh’s Leith Depot (November 6) and Manchester’s Klondyke Club (November 7), then return to Ramsgate Music Hall, this time with Swansea Sound (November 14). For more information follow the band via Bandcamp, Facebook, Instagram, and Skep Wax Records.
With extra thanks to man of great taste Steve Worrall at the wonderful Retro Man Blog for his live photographs of Railcard. You can find his splendid site via this link.
